Curse

Daenara · Jan 16, 2008, 09:51 AM // 09:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by undeadgun

i was doing my randomway since umm 3 weeks ago lol, until now, everyday the same, got friend's wife rank 3 on x mas, she said that was the best x mas gift ever:P

And it caused me to absolutely love HA :P I know people claim that it's glory days are over... but I've had an absolute ball. I'm almost rank 5 now, and it's basically because of Undead and Monkus and Mishak and all those kickass guys who've been so patient with me ! Much love for you alll..

skarkees · Jan 16, 2008, 01:07 PM // 13:07

I never see why people talk that much about ranks.

I mean Offcourse i want my r12 (not possible for me

but still).

But ranks says mostly nothing about how good someone is. Rank is just a number (and thats a fact). Rank CAN (remember CAN) say if you have alot of experience in HA, but on the otherhand it can also be a r9 iway person.

And thats why people dont need to look for ranks but look in friendlist, guild, alliance. Allthough i have to say when i need a PUG i will look for high ranks though but thats just the benefit of having a rank. Poeple know there will be a bigger chance that you are good when you have a higher rank. But in the end Teams made of friends, guildies and Alliance who plays alot together owns mostly every high ranked (r9+) PUG.

For the lower ranks: Try to make a good PVP friendlist and train alot in RA, TA. Then: having a team that knows each other isnt all

. You also need to go through your positions on the maps. Each map each build requires a different positioning. Learn how to kite, where to stand on altar maps, who you need to send back on capture points etc.
Then your build. Try to stick on a main build for a while. If you are a good spiker at HA make a balanced spike build. But always remember builds need to have snares (for capture,relic etc), speedboost (make haste for example) and a good defense ( you can run 2 monk backline but then take a 3th person like water ele and let him take ward against harm for the monks to kite thtough).
Also watch the meta (talk with your team about how to deal with iway (take a well of silence for example and pressure the para 8 down).

This is just a fast guide of how to do HA. I think the best thing to do is sending a PM to someone who is good at HA (who is doin tactics in halls etc) and ask if he will explain the HA for you. Im sure there are high ranked people wich are also very good who wants to teach you those things. Just get on vent and talk about it.

miraaz · Jan 16, 2008, 02:38 PM // 14:38

I agree with the discrimination against lower ranks but you should understand us, higher ranked people.
You see, with every rank we need more fame to advance, and we need people with skill to be able to earn fame. If your unranked, just check out builds from pvx and start an unranked build. Some of your friends SURELY do atleast some HA, so you should be able to get to teams through them. But honestly, you can't blame it on higher ranked people. Sure, some guys are total twats who start yelling "noob" in the chat, but you should just ignore them. But we also want to advance, and to do that, we need skilled people, and taking a low ranked mean (s)he doesn't know much about HA and may do something stupid, screwing up the whole team (no offence anyone here). So seriously, you could try understanding us too.

Signet Of Hell · Jan 16, 2008, 02:53 PM // 14:53

There will always be elitism, no matter how much anyone talks about it. This topic is like every other topic that has been started about this issue. Go to HA, look out for a guild recruiting,a guild prepared to take in new players (no matter how much you say there isn't, there is, you just aren't looking on forums etc) and play with them. Stop crying because you can't get r3 in 2 days and play with "pros", everyone who hasn't been carried by top-ranked guilds for their titles have grinded like this, and it takes a long time. It's just a lot easier if you join a guild, because you get regular HA with the same people, thats how good guilds form.

elektra_lucia · Jan 16, 2008, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Quote:

This topic is like every other topic that has been started about this issue.

Quote:

Stop crying because you can't get r3 in 2 days and play with "pros",

I don't think you understood what I was writing? gb2b?

Ms Jazz · Jan 17, 2008, 03:10 AM // 03:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by undeadgun

well. yesterday i was form randomway for alliance ppl and guilde, ended up with an average of r0-r6 group(i am r10 atm). i simplely put one comment when i form my group: if you want to win, you want fame, dont even bother to come, if you want to learn, you are the right person to join my group. i think this is a better way of a higher ranked people should do for lower ranked people, teaching>winning.and i forbid any alliance people or guilde to join iway unless they are rank 10+ play for fun. Iway is the worst build that a new player could start with imho.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kissable Krissy

Well.... seeing as I am in Undead's guild... I have to agree with him. My boyfriend and I just got r9 and we have NO problem playing with our guildies-even the r0 guildies

. As long as they are there to learn and have fun, I have no problem playing with them.

I have no problem playing with someone that is low ranked IF they are willing to learn and don't expect me to just be farming them fame. When someone in HA asks for a build, I tend to whisper them a rather legitimate build and help them in any manner that I can-if I'm in the mood. There is no rule that says I have to help them.

If the low ranked or unranked person is just being a loud obnoxious noob, then he can stay that way and will be that way regardless if he is r1 or r11 and it would take more than 3k per fame to get me to help them.

I am one of low ranked people in undead's guild.. since I came back to HA an year after...Obviously I am noob but after playing and learning with guildies now I can play with my guildies or alliance peeps (mostly r9+) with no prob (most of time lawl) ppl even ask me to play with them

now i am r5 almost to r6 ^_^ from r3 Willing to learn and to have fun are the most important points tho sometimes we fail but i think after failing if you know what went wrong and can fix it then peeps <33 u

hurdlebeast · Jan 18, 2008, 06:56 AM // 06:56

i agree totally with this thread. I do not have HA unlocked yet (i am mainly pve right now), but I can see just in AB and other PvP matches how stubborn some noobs can be. This is coming from a noob: I am not generally a pvp player. I know that pve is not PvP. sliver armor builds, nuker builds, other ele builds that work wonders in PvE don't do crap against a good, or even semi-good team of pvp players. I understand this, but more importantly, I try to learn from it. I learn from mistakes. Meteor shower works in AB when i can hide amongst a MM's army. It is pretty much useless when I try to cap a shrine solo. Things like this do not cross the minds of players who are there just for the faction, or the fame. I make mistakes, and i apologize for them 99% of the time. I'll go through 8 or 9 games of AB and will still switch up some skills depending on my team and how they run. But most importantly, I listen to people. If someone (who is obviously not a noob) tells me to try something else, I will. I'll tell every PUG i join that I am not a PvP guy, that yeah i'm a little better than a complete noob, but not much more :P And if a guy that clearly knows better asks me to do something, damn straight i'm gonna do it, and if I fail, it's probably because I did something wrong, not because he doesn't know what he's doing.

Basically, I'm trying to say that the problem doesn't just lie in HA, but in PvP in general (and in PvE a bit, but not as much of a problem there), and there is some hope. for every ten kids that think they are a god of Guild Wars, there is (hopefully) one mature player that knows he/she is not.

that's my 2 cents

Lord Darksoul · Jan 21, 2008, 07:17 AM // 07:17

Thought I see your point, TC, I think you're being a bit broad here. I could not read every single post, but I had skimmed a bit of everyone else's posts before replying (Read yours completely though).

I think there are two subsets of low ranked players you're splitting here.

There are newbies to PvP/HA and there are noobs/nubs.

Newbies are those guys who are low ranked because they hopped on to HA too late. These guys are pretty bad (I’m one of these), make stupid mistakes, aren’t familiar with the maps, etc. However, ALL newbies will learn through EXPERIENCE. It’s kinda like SAT Prep. They make you take model tests over and over and over until you’re familiar with the style and strategies you have to use to pull off a good score. Same with HA. You just gotta jump in until you finally can get the hang of it. Think about it, do you think [DF] started Guild Wars as leetsauce players who could prolly run 8 trappers and still win against rank 1000’s? Based on my personal experiences, you have to jump in with a capable group into HA and learn by doing this repeatedly.

Noobs, on the other hand, are quite similar to newbies, but different in many ways. They are pretty bad, won’t admit that and believe they’re good, insult other players, act as know-it-alls, and overall fail at having fun and learning, but succeed in making everyone upset. These peeps are the low rankers who make all low rankers look bad.

Said earlier, from my point of view, you have to play yourself and not just watch Observer to learn how to play in the various maps. It’s different watching a video with a coach teaching you the specifics of freestyle and actually swimming in the water. Doing both will definitely help, but just watching does not give you skill. The problem is, those who are noobs make all low rankers look bad and therefore make ALL of us undesirable as potential teammates. How can we get better without actually playing?

I’ll admit I’ve done stupid things, I’ve monk /danced and somehow went far enough to start the Zaishen timer. I’ve misspiked. I’ve done a bunch of stupid stuff, but I’ve learned. And that’s the important thing, people learn. I have played ----ways. But at the very least, I know a little more of what to do, I don’t argue with those who know more than I do, I may ask questions, but definitely not impose my ideas on more experienced people. That’s how newbies are. We’re not here to be a thorn, we want to play HA and get good at it. Sure we may suck, but we’ll improve. That’s the most important thing, we get better.

P.S. Topic Creator (elektra_lucia iirc) I was wondering if your guild had any people on at about GMT -8 7PM-11PM and if it’s still accepting people. I would be incredibly thankful should you allow me to join your guild and learn from my betters. PM me whether I can or cannot join. Thanks.

elektra_lucia · Jan 21, 2008, 02:54 PM // 14:54

It was ages ago I made the thread, I disbanded that guild and the idea of it :P. At the moment I'm kind of semi looking for a GVG guild. I agree there is noobs and newbs; however, generally there isn't a huge reason to take either. Of course there is always an exception to the rule...

Lord Darksoul · Jan 22, 2008, 02:06 AM // 02:06

If you don't take the newbies, how'll they get better? How did you get better if you could play?

There isn't a huge reason to pick them over a better person also wanting to play, but there's no reason to ban them from playing with you either.

lacasner · Jan 22, 2008, 02:08 AM // 02:08

In short, with enough dedication it can be done, but the general consensus is that the current layout for up and coming players is terrible for non-hardcore people. That is why it should change, as hardcore people generally make up small percentage of game (if we are going with the usual Anet policy of updates and changes)

Kyp Jade · Jan 22, 2008, 02:15 AM // 02:15

HA has been extremly dumbed down for new players and those wishing to get fame. (three 1v1 maps right at the start). The problem with this approach is that strong 1v1 kill builds will get fame (iway/sway/hexway) but not really learn much about team play with the exception of hexway which can support relic running and altar holding (relic run, kill count, cap pt, altar holding).

If you want people to learn and get better, there needs to be a stronger emphasis on team plays than on build wars and fame farming. However Anet has turned the game into a title farm, and the hero track is one of them.

TaCktiX · Jan 22, 2008, 04:50 AM // 04:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyp Jade

HA has been extremly dumbed down for new players and those wishing to get fame. (three 1v1 maps right at the start). The problem with this approach is that strong 1v1 kill builds will get fame (iway/sway/hexway) but not really learn much about team play with the exception of hexway which can support relic running and altar holding (relic run, kill count, cap pt, altar holding).

If you want people to learn and get better, there needs to be a stronger emphasis on team plays than on build wars and fame farming. However Anet has turned the game into a title farm, and the hero track is one of them.

QFT. The number of times I get a group good enough to get to Unholy Temples or Forgotten Shrines, we usually get rolled right back down the second we get there. Burial Mounds was added for the double points weekend overflow when it had been removed, and WAS NOT re-removed after the weekend. That third map is a killer for a lot of groups that need team experience on "higher" maps.

guildwars101 · Jan 23, 2008, 01:42 PM // 13:42

no i agree low ranks need experience to be good in HA...the hard part is finding a way to get them that experience so they can get better

Kyp Jade · Jan 23, 2008, 02:01 PM // 14:01

experience comes from playing the game. I had quit guild wars after attaining rank 6 last year (1k fame) and came back early in the summer. Before that I was a bspike noob, all i wanted was fame.

I came back just before last summer, and I decided I wanted to play balanced builds. (where my definition of balanced is a build that is build against as many situations as it can, in HA this means building against the map objectives first, then against the meta)

It took me a long time to get a guild put together, nearly 2 months I think, and by time summer came I had a regular core team that I played with almost nightly. I can't tell you exactly how long it took for me to figure out how to play on the better maps, I CAN tell you it didnt happen overnight when I decided to play balance. There was a LOT of fail involved. most of the players i started with were r3 or lower, today they are r9-r10.

If low ranks want experience, they need to stop kiding themselves hoping for someone to give it to them, they need to go get it.

Qual · Jan 23, 2008, 02:33 PM // 14:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyp Jade

experience comes from playing the game. I had quit guild wars after attaining rank 6 last year (1k fame) and came back early in the summer. Before that I was a bspike noob, all i wanted was fame.

I came back just before last summer, and I decided I wanted to play balanced builds. (where my definition of balanced is a build that is build against as many situations as it can, in HA this means building against the map objectives first, then against the meta)

It took me a long time to get a guild put together, nearly 2 months I think, and by time summer came I had a regular core team that I played with almost nightly. I can't tell you exactly how long it took for me to figure out how to play on the better maps, I CAN tell you it didnt happen overnight when I decided to play balance. There was a LOT of fail involved. most of the players i started with were r3 or lower, today they are r9-r10.

If low ranks want experience, they need to stop kiding themselves hoping for someone to give it to them, they need to go get it.

This is some of the best stuff I have read on guru for a long time. I wished all low ranked people would read this and stop crying...

elektra_lucia · Jan 23, 2008, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Quote:

If you don't take the newbies, how'll they get better?

From teaching themselves? Why do I want people to get 'better' when I can take an already 'better' player?

Be nice to face worse teams. Free fame FTW. Rofl.

I don't 'ban' myself from playing with them, but hey. 8 man team, not everyone will be in the mood to be with a nub. It is actually pretty hard finding a good team, unless you take friend list. Which will be on at certain times, where as I'm on all the time.

Quote:

How did you get better if you could play?

Playing the game and looking at what I did wrong after/during the match. Same as it is now really...

Wait... So this whole thing about playing with high rank people is about improving? You're telling me it's not to get more fame, because higher rank groups are generally better but instead it's to improve at the game?

Oh....... Wait, you think a low rank person should join a high rank group and will 'improve' from this. So I'm thinking, this is because the high rank group will know what to do and tell them what to do?

.

Well that speaks of fail...

The group will react to the mistakes and do things they wouldn't normally do. Also, joining a high rank group to improve ones self is no different to using someone. So while the low rank player might say I'm mean for generally not taking them; in addition, they void themselves of showing a decent personality.

Do you follow?

P.S. Did you read the majority of my post (I appreciate it was long) where I say how low rank people are often stubborn? Or are you replying to the topic title?

Tyla · Jan 23, 2008, 06:12 PM // 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Qual

This is some of the best stuff I have read on guru for a long time. I wished all low ranked people would read this and stop crying...

Agreed.../vote for best post award!

AfroThunder396 · Jan 27, 2008, 10:20 PM // 22:20

As a general PvP noob I find it easier just to be honest when looking for a group. When I ask the party leader to join I just ask them straight out 'I'm familiar with the build you're looking for, but I'm not ranked yet. Will this be a problem?' Mixed results so far, but most people at least appreciate the honesty. If they ask why I should be let in the group, I just tell them that I'm good at listening to directions. As long as they are aware that I know my place in the food chain they generally dont have a problem.

Keithark · Jan 28, 2008, 10:24 PM // 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyp Jade

HA has been extremly dumbed down for new players and those wishing to get fame. (three 1v1 maps right at the start). The problem with this approach is that strong 1v1 kill builds will get fame (iway/sway/hexway) but not really learn much about team play with the exception of hexway which can support relic running and altar holding (relic run, kill count, cap pt, altar holding).

If you want people to learn and get better, there needs to be a stronger emphasis on team plays than on build wars and fame farming. However Anet has turned the game into a title farm, and the hero track is one of them.

Easy way to fix...make /ranks for other titles and no more noobs looking for fame..most true "noobs" don't care about fame or even PvP in the least they just want Bambi. Make emotes for Vanquish, Guardian, or some of the higher end PvE and lose 3/4 of the "noobs" right off the bat. Those that are left are people who really want to play PvP and should be a little better to play with than the PvE title farmers